SPECIAL REPORT: Can I get a DPF Delete?

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TORONTO, Ont. — As long as there have been pollution controls on engines, someone has tried to mess with them, either by removing, bypassing or modifying components. With all the distrust over newer truck engines, it’s not entirely surprising that some owner/operators and small fleet owners might consider tampering with their exhaust gas recirculation (EGR) and diesel particulate filer (DPF) systems.

But what is surprising is how much of this is going on. Although it is technically illegal to obstruct or dismantle pollution controls on trucks, the almost total lack of enforcement across Canadian jurisdictions has allowed some vendors to quickly fill this niche. Calling around, within half an hour, I found several independent garages in Ontario and Quebec that would remove and delete the EGR/DPF systems from almost any EPA-compliant engine.

Either by Internet or word of mouth, truck owners are attracted to shops and vendors that promise better fuel mileage, more horsepower and an end to expensive DPF maintenance bills. With the addition of a straight pipe running through the gutted DPF canister, the modified tractors look almost identical to the ones coming from the factory.

Beyond the reach of Environment Canada, and existing in the grey area of seemingly unregulated “aftermarket modifications,” the practice seems to have picked up steam in the last six months. One garage in Montreal has a two-week waiting list and claims to process 20 rigs per day. A simple search of the Internet turned up an online vendor in British Columbia who openly boasted, “SAVE UP TO 3 MPG!…We can eliminate the DPF-EGR from your Cat C7,C9, C13 or C15, Cummins ISB, ISC, ISL, ISX, Detroit DDEC 4&5 engines.”

The president of J-Ball Electronics, Don Jenner, answered the phone himself when I called an 800-number listed on the above Web site, posing as the owner of a 2009 Peterbilt having problems with the DPF system.

“You and about four million other people!” he joked. “I can take you back to the good old days,” he assured me. He promptly e-mailed me a prospective work order and pricing for “several scenarios” as well as step-by-step instructions on how to remove the turbo and EGR cooler. The final step declared: “Kiss your downtime goodbye!”

Located in Vernon B.C., most of Jenner’s business is by mail order, it seems, with truck owners removing the ECMs from their trucks and shipping them to him by courier for reprogramming. Most likely, his clients would engage a private shop to get their work done using the plates and gaskets that can also be ordered from this supplier, depending on what strategy is employed to defeat the soot burner and EGR cooler.

Reprogramming the ECM to run at a much leaner mixture is crucial to this process and costs thousands of dollars. Evidently, DPF deletion takes about six hours to complete, but the real cash cow in all this is the software. Once the engine codes have been hacked and modified, the program costs nothing to copy and is easy to franchise to other garages, and is the most expensive part of the procedure.

Checking with a few black market garages, the price for the modifications varies from around $3,000-$6,600 depending on the model engine and which methodology the customer wishes to pursue. And Jenner didn’t flinch when I ask him if the tampering is illegal, although he admitted, “We are bending the rules.” Another vendor admitted, after some prodding, “It is illegal…I guess.”

In over-the-phone conversations with other DPF Delete providers, assurances were given that this won’t hurt the engine, but rather, will dramatically increase performance. And the fuel savings can be astronomical, tens of thousands of litres per year is the claim. One garage owner in Central Ontario told me that I could expect to get 50 or 60 more horsepower and much better mileage. More importantly, he promised to tune the exhaust so that it could pass emissions thresholds set by the Ministry of Transportation during inspections that are required every two years in Ontario. A technician at J-Ball Electronics in Vernon, B.C. seemed to concur: “We’ve had lots of guys (from Ontario) running these and haven’t had any complaints or issues.”

It’s worth noting that these are not small, fly-by-night repair shops, as some drivers suggested on the CB radio. The businesses I contacted were mainstream engine tuning and truck repair operations. One fellow was hungry enough for business that he called me back a couple of times, and told me he’d been doing these conversions for two years. He also claimed to have deleted the DPF-EGR on an entire fleet of Class 8 trucks.

Most owner/operators have heard rumours of this kind of thing going on, others may know someone who has had their emissions system “modified.” After getting stuck behind snowplows with a bunch of truck drivers on my way into Toronto last week, opinion on the CB radio was mixed. One driver was annoyed that people are getting away with breaking the law and not playing fair. Another driver told of a bad experience trying to bypass emissions controls on his 2007 engine, and had to replace the whole system eventually, so he obviously didn’t recommend it.

But frustration around EPA-compliant engines post-2007 is understandable. Replacement parts are very expensive: a blown EGR cooler can cost thousands of dollars. Perhaps part of the problem lies with the OEMs, themselves, and poor communications after some start-up problems with the first generation EGRs. It’s not hard to find drivers who have had problems with these engines. One service manager told me about a fleet of 12 trucks that was literally “glued to the yard” because of DPF problems.

Via e-mail, owner/operator Elwood Rines complained about the cost of maintaining the DPF, cleaning the filter and injectors and “all of the things that the dealer doesn’t tell you about.” Rines runs long-haul for Bison Transport out of Winnipeg. He had heard through the grapevine that DPF deletion was going on.

“I wondered when guys would start tampering with the exhaust,” he quipped.

But Rines is pretty sure removing the EGR/DPF is not the solution. “Not interested,” said Rines. “I traded in a 2009 last April because it was regenerating at inappropriate times. But this 2013 Volvo has been good so far with mileage between 7 and 7.5 mpg.”

It is worth noting that some of the shops I called were strongly against this practice, while others were quite willing to provide referrals to places that had no qualms about doing so. But one garage manager and part owner takes a dim view of businesses offering this service.

“It is totally illegal and unethical,” according to Joe Cuffaro of Cambec Diesel in Montreal, Que. “These trucks are born with this. In the long run they may have to reverse the process.”

Cuffaro suggests that it is only a matter of time before provincial governments crack down on these operations.

“It’s not the case that these trucks are spewing a lot of pollution,” he says. “If you do a sniffer test on them you’ll find they run very, very clean. But what gives them the right to remove the original equipment? If I’m Paccar, I have to answer to federal regulations, but who do these guys answer to? The worst-case scenario would be if one of our customers got nailed doing this and it got traced back to us. That’s why we don’t do it.”

DPF delete suppliers might argue that they are providing a service that customers want, and since the modified units will pass emissions tests, what is the harm in doing so? As well, if the regulations are vague, unenforceable and no one has been charged, why not provide this option?

But from another perspective, disconnecting emiss
ions controls is wrong on many levels. The tragedy of this situation is that the latest EPA10-compliant engines seem to have most of the bugs worked out of them, and they produce almost zero NOx and extremely low levels of particulate. If everyone followed the rules, the case could be made that these newer engines shouldn’t even be required to undergo emissions testing as the air coming out of the exhaust is almost breathable.

But removing EGR and DPF systems from trucks means you’re running the emissions wide open once again, and we’re back to pre-2002 levels. And taking a larger view, widespread EGR/DPF tampering is a step backwards for an industry and manufacturers that have taken great pains to show they are good environmental players. Although provincial environment ministries have dropped the ball on this issue, there are some indications that they are starting to pay attention, and that enhanced fines and beefed-up enforcement cannot be very far off.

– This is part two of a two-part series on emissions tampering. You can read part one here.

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Harry Rudolfs has worked as a dishwasher, apprentice mechanic, editor, trucker, foreign correspondent and taxi driver. He's written hundreds of articles for North American and European journals and newspapers, including features for the Ottawa Citizen, Toronto Life and CBC radio.

With over 30 years experience in the trucking industry he's hauled cars, steel, lumber, chemicals, auto parts and general freight as well as B-trains. He holds an honours BA in creative writing and humanities, summa cum laude.

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  • Our company bought 15 new trucks with Cat engines in 2008. Those trucks just about broke us. Break downs causing major headaches, driver dissatisfaction – they wanted out of them, and customers who wanted to send their business elsewhere if we couldn’t get our act together. We were forced to get rid of the emissions systems for survival. Now those trucks are reliable and get better fuel mileage.

    Explain to me how a truck that gets 5mph vs a truck that gets 7mph is better for the environment?

    • I have broke down everytime I’ve tried to take a job since january of 2014 replaced the entire system and here I am 2 days into my new job and I’m derated scr fault.its drained my accounts from downtime then borrowing tens of thousands off of family. This def scr s**t should be illegal not the removal of it.volvo parking lots are so full of these derated trucks there’s no room in all the shops in alberta the parking lots are over flowing! Time to do something about it and I will never buy a truck with this on it again.I had a boss that deleted his brand new 2014 kw zero km and never had a problem! This is the way to go

    • I have a 2008 cat that is deleted. Need someone who deletes them to work on it. Doesn’t run right? Any ideas? Who where? Upstate NY but would be willing to go where ever.

  • The way the 5mpg truck is better for the environment is because it’s probably parked half the time and not in use! These emmission control systems have forced the trucking industry to become the guinea pigs at the cost of thousands of dollars per truck. All to make the politicians look good and have the public think they are doing something for the environment. You ever see the amount of smoke coming out of an engine when the EGR valve fails? No way that can be better for the environment. We had a truck parked for 6 weeks and 5 different shops including 2 Cummins dealers could not find the problem. After $8000 dollars and nothing fixed, a Cummins dealer quietly told us to unplug the EGR valve and see if it fixes the problem. He said they couldn’t do it themselves and the computer couldn’t tell them if that was the problem. But he said run it a couple days like that and we would know if that was the problem. So you tell me, when the dealer that manufactures the engine can’t even diagnose the problem, what choices do we have?

    • Hey Fedup!
      We agree with you 100% that the dealer service centers are worthless…they don’t know how to diagnose or prevent issues, they just know how to put a “band-aid” on when there is a fault code.
      Issues like this is why we started our company…tired of seeing truckers in over and over for the same after-treatment related issues with no answers being provided.
      We are a California based company that is changing the industry by providing EPA and CARB compliant ECM modifications that trucks need in order to have their after treatment system finally run properly.
      Please check out http://www.lloyddiesel.com and find us on Facebook.
      Hang in there man!

      • This is all the EPA fault they force manufacturers to put out an engine that meets the EPA requirements so the companies build a test engine hook it all up to these pollution sniffers and wahla pressto it runs clean!! NOW BACK TO THE REAL WORLD down the road 50000 miles later it starts to malfuntion ,know why ,because it was,t ready for over the road real world driving ,up hill down hill and worse lots of cruising on the level where the exhaust never gets hot enough to keep carbon burned from dpf filters I had a px8 paccar that was so bad by the time it had 78000 miles on it I replaced 4tubos 3sets of injectors and had to have dpf cleaned 2times,oh and one egr valve various sensors!!Frustrating to say the least but that’s not all this thing ran terrible one day a guy following me asked in a polite way if I would let him pass me as my exhaust fumes were so bad was getting sick !Now how can this be good for the environment?? So before I retired I got the delete done to the truck it involved putting a 5inch pipe thru the cat and dpf put a plate underneath the egr valve and I had the computer reprogrammed well let me tell you that was money well spent milage went from 4to around 7.5 miles per gallon it ran great smooth good throttle response lots more torque and just for shits and giggles I had the dealership check the emmissions on third fancie new tester the mechanic told me well it’s ok cleaner than most I’ve tested ,,now he didn’t,t know about the delete I got to run it about 3mounths before I retired but I know the guy who got it and he said it’s still running perfect he said whatever you did you hit a home run it still passes emission testing? So just how good are these new systems?you don’t need to feel like you’re doing harm to mother nature if you’re passing the emmissions tests!!!oh by the way that was two years ago since I took retirement my replacement got at least 2years without engine troubles I was lucky to go two weeks!!

    • Cars have had egr’s since 1975 & they have very little problem & really getting a lot better fuel milage. Big truck factories built these million mile motors & loosing $$$$$$ so they had to put something on them to blow them more often $$$$$$

    • Harry Rudolfs claim that manufacturers have taken great pains to show they are good enviromental players apparently doesn’t have a bunch of maxx force powered trucks sitting in his yard that they can’t give away. I guess all the law suits against Navistar are all fabricated?. They sold crappy engines and knew they were a bunch of junk when they were new.

  • Anyone remember when ABS brakes first came out on the truck market? How they caused so many problems due to poor design that they had to be withdrawn from the market? Same scenario here. They should remove this garbage until they have got it right.

  • I’m not condoning this practice but if it is as widespread as you say it is Harry, someone needs to ask why are these people spending thousands of dollars per truck to have this equipment removed? I don’t think anyone is actually against clean air, nobody wants pollution, so why remove this equipment at great expense? The reason is because it doesn’t work, and makes the vehicle unreliable, and too expensive to operate, as well as too heavy in some applications. The OEMs and the government agencies that mandated these poorly thought out and poorly designed systems are the root cause of these problems, so the end users should not have to accept all the blame here. A weight allowance to compensate for the added weight of this equipment, as well as some kind of “clean air tax credit” to help maintain these unreliable systems, would help somewhat. Bottom line is that people in government and at the OEM level need to realize that trucks are not cars, they are industrial equipment, and should be designed to industrial standards, not the same standards as light duty cars are. I laughed when I read the emissions warranty on my 2012 Volvo, it is the same as my car’s warranty, 60 months or 161000 km ( 5 years or 100,000 miles). Less than one years warranty under normal truck useage. What does that tell you about the manufacturer’s confidence in their equipment? And speaking of other industrial equipment, what are the emission standards for railroad locomotives, ships, aircraft, and construction equipment?

  • “Checking with a few black market garages”

    Seriously Harry? Seems like a lot of chicken little talk here. I don’t know of a lot of small fleets or owner-operators that don’t cross the border. I can’t enter a port or a government facility in the US with anything that doesn’t pass emissions, and I’ve been tested @ several scales across the US.

    If you’re a regional operator, how do you get around a mandatory emissions test in Ontario? Seems to me that if someone can devise an alternative to the slap-dash methods used by the industry to pass emissions and it works, then I’d say they’ve built a better mousetrap as opposed to calling them “black market garages”. And I would imagine that the thousands of people that have gone or are going broke trying to run 2008 spec’ed junk would agree with me.

    I’ll leave the “unethical” comments for another day when we discuss predatory pricing.

  • Once again, Truck News is at the beckon call of the CTA. The CTA thinks this is a “problem” so lets do a big feature on it. Seems like the CTA is against anything anyone does to be more competitive, thus protecting their membership who are mostly very old school laggards. All you need to do is look at the amount of US companies on our highways (many using Canadian O/O’s) to see how out of touch they are competitively.

  • Well John, should I phrase it “otherwise reputable, mainstream shops that are offering quasi-legal services”? Though, I’m sure there are technicians and mechanics in smaller garages who would do this work. Heck, there’s probably a video on U-Tube that shows you how to do it. One would have to get the engine codes, though, and be able to reprogram the ECM. And these larger “alternative businesses” have done their homework, researching specific engine types and fine tuning their craft…And yes they claim they pass opacity tests in the US and California or wherever. And wouldn’t it be great to forget about that pesky DEF light?

    Lastly, Dave, don’t consider myself a shill for the OTA and never have been. Leave that to the Road Knights.

    • You wanna ‘ve a big boy journalist ask the epa the tough questions as to why companies have to suffer this failed system of emissions control

  • The same is happening here in England, but we’re now facing euro 6&7 regulations and removing DPF and EGR systems won’t work for us anymore as we’re now tested for NOx. Our engines are now being cleaned using an American developed chemistry package BG Products that is giving us results in some instances of zero emissions with full pollution gear running on all our DPF & EGR vehicles.

  • Well, thanks for publishing this and making it more known. I can see the end coming now, just like what has happened to the pickup truck tuners. Pretty soon we will all be forced to go even more broke thanks to the EPA and the unreliable, unefficient junk engines they are forcing upon us.
    I’ve said it before……with all the recent advertising, I can see them putting an end to the glider kit trend too.

    I even HAD to delete my pickup just to make it somewhat reliable and get any kind of fuel mileage. These are very sad times.

  • “otherwise reputable, mainstream shops that are offering quasi-legal services”

    Yeah, that’s better. 🙂

    My point is simply this. (And I don’t speak from experience either as I don’t have any EPA 2010 equipment) If the end game is to reduce pollution and someone has found a way to do it, why should that make it illegal? Remember the only reason that government stipulated no tampering with emissions systems was because people like me (and maybe even you) done what they could to make their gas engines run better when they cobbled this stuff up in the ’70’s.

    Remember also that when EPA 2010 was introduced, exhaust stacks got bigger in diameter and included 5 or 6 nifty intake holes at the base which introduces fresh air into the exhaust thereby diluting the nasty flow of particulate out the pipe. So are we really cleaning the air or giving out false emissions readings here? And by gov’t mandate no less.

    And when I think about it, I don’t know why this is any sort of issue, and I’ll tell you why. I remember reading in this very publication some years ago a piece authored by no less a luminary than Dave Bradley himself. The article was of course in support of speed limiters, and Dave’s position was that if all these nasty trucks were simply governed @ 105kmh, the reduction in greenhouse gases accomplished by the speed limiter would be huge. If memory serves, he had charts and diagrams to support his position too, so going by that article alone I would posit that we are over the hump regarding nasty emissions. or am I wrong?

    • I agree with the removal of this crap system. I have a 2011 386 Peterbilt 450 Cummins ISX, I have had this truck for 2 years and have had to dump well over $45,000.00 into yep that’s right DEC system, new DOC, filters cleaned 3 different times 6 new injectors, new cam, lifters, turbo and the damn thing is down again due to after treatment problems AGAIN. Also my 98 379 extended hood with a 600 Cat got better duel mileage then this 386 does. I am getting 4.8 to 5.3 mpg with this 386 and that is sorry, this truck should be running upper 6’s say 6.5 for fuel mileage. A mechanic at a Peterbilt dealership flat out told me get rid of all that BS and you will get much better fuel mileage and performance of the motor. Now think about the fuel mileage, a 1.5 to 2 mile per gallon increase over a years time in itself is a lot of money into my pocket, not to mention the savings in aftertreatment break downs and repairs and my sown time. 6 days down time while in a shop, with the parts and labor that is at an average of $10-$15,000.00 in six days even more in loss. All due to the aftertreatment system. Now you tell me the right answer.. im going broke and it is all due to the environmental BS. Is the EPA going to reimburse me for the money lost as well as spent on their B’S? Hell no they aren’t. This emissions junk is just that JUNK a money stealing joke that has cost me a fortune.

      C. Brant

  • The right wing passed the laws in 2004, and now they do not enforce them, the sound specification is 92 decibel, How about the enforce that also.
    If you are not going to enforce the law, why did HARPO blabber about the new regulations, just recently. It just makes a person sick of the BS, are they going to enforce it later and I have to reinstall everything. Make up their mind or get out of the way!

  • Firstly, there would be a lot less incentives to tamper with DPF systems if they actually worked as promised and did not impose such a huge MPG penalty.
    Yes, its new technology and manufacturers need time to work out the bugs but what gives them the right to make end users of their products pay such a heavy price in terms of down time and endless frustration.

    Having said that, I agree that simply deleting the DPF systems creates an unfair playing field. Only enforcement will correct the present flouting of the rules that I see as very prevalent in my occupational circles.

  • Who in their right mind would want to come work in this wonderful “Trucking Industry” and yet it is one of the biggest and most demanding.
    These poor truck drivers! What use to be a fun and rewarding Job, not to mention, paid well, has now turned into what?? Don’t even know what to call this. But who would want to drive a truck today, or for that matter own one. No wonder we have to hire outside the country to fill the positions.
    Truckers today are forced to do whatever they can just to pay the bills. Is there any other industry where the government tells you what to do?? Drive this many hrs, drive this fast, run newer equipment, etc.
    I’ve heard of a lot of owner operators re mortgaging their house just to keep their truck moving up and down the road. Is that fair?
    Why doesn’t the government help the engine manufactures come out with Really good Engines. If cummins or Detroit came out with an engine this year that got 10 mpg, even old truck would be off the road and new truck sales would go through the roof. Now i do agree, they do look promising. We have customers with the new Detroit and Volvo engines getting 8 us, thats a lot better than any truck getting only 6 mpg. So why hang onto the truck at 6 mpg.
    Let them Delete DPF’s and EGR’s if its the only way for them to make money. They still pass the Opacity Snap test, and if they get better fuel economy, than they’re burning less fuel anyway – Great!
    If this gets enforced, than look out, the industry will Fall Apart! more so than it is already. Engine Manufactures, Come out with something good!!

  • Dont buy new wait till it (If ever it is proven)
    to be good,or better.
    No hurry Iam old and better.

  • I find it frustrating that governments and trucking alliances are steadily increasing the hoops that owner operators have to jump through just to make a living in their own equipment.

    The EGR, then the DPF and now the DEF technologies were introduced with little paractical otr testing. these technologies were not in use long enough to have the oem’s work on engineering revisions to make the equipment even remotely reliable.

    Grass roots techinicians and engineers come up with a viable alternative to these underdeveloped technologies and market them effectively to those who need them.

    My 05 EGR truck never made me a reasonable wage until i purchased the EGR delete kit. Since then i have had 3 good years.

    Now Truck News has transitioned from being part of the solution as an industry publication, to part of the problem by exposing a working man’s solution to most costly snafu to be legislated onto the industry.

  • My 2005 EGR engine blew an average of 15.0% Opacity before i got the delete kit installed. The next opacity snap test averaged a 4.2% with the EGR delete kit installed.

    This is the honest truth.

    My fuel mileage improved and the horsepower increase was significant.

    i’m just sayin’

      • Hello Lean,
        I’m just beginning my info quest with the dpf delete. Have you made a decision and if so which route did you go and are you happy with if.

  • Well, having a DPF vehicle just over one year that I tow a fifth wheel trailer with, I am afraid to pull in to campgrounds. I have started fires on more than one occasion, I caught them and put them out, but what if someone else was in my position? Would they have caught it? What makes more sense, burn more fuel and a little cleaner out the tailpipe, or burn a campground down (forest) and cause a disaster. I don’t know about anyone else, but I’d rather keep forest intact, as the trees help clean the air.

    Besides, this is all a huge cash cow for the oil companies. They can make huge improvements with emission controls via engine management. If the turbo lag did not exists, you would not have the “black soot” out the tailpipe. The DPF system design was a knee-jerk reaction. As far as I am concerned, it is a dangerous design. I am speaking from not only a personal point of view, but as professional tradesman as well.

  • These diesel trucks are very expensive, and will cost major bucks when the dpf gets choked up. You will eventually get choked up right back to the turbo. So, manufacturers where forced by gov. to come up with a band aid solution to meet approved emission standards, hmmm. Gov. eh!!. Will let the darn gov. pay for my expensive bills when the truck is sitting because off emission repairs. Pay for everything, even loss revenue. Now would gov. be so quick to enact, or would they put pressure on manufacturers to get it working correctly before allowing these descripted trucks sold to customers who are trying to make a living, and shelling out big bucks I might add to buy them.

    I hear the newer trucks are doing better, but what about the earlier models? Those trucks are what’s causing owners to get the dpf and what not deleted. They have too, or go broke. It’s fine for some one to complain and say that’s illegal, but are they shelling out dollars after dollars for repairs and loss revenue. I would say not so, they are just complaining because they have nothing else to do and that’s what they do. If they just bought a new diesel big rig or just a diesel P/U and ended up with all kinds of shop down time, while paying out the monthly payments on the stupid technology truck, they would be complaining too.

    You have to experience this new technology to understand. It’s a rip off so far, but hopefully the manufacturers get it right. I am in favour off low emissions and helping the environment, but I don’t have the bank account to foot the darn repair bills and down time. Now if everyone, would only help me with my repairs and down time, then hey, lets all go for it.

  • Marty, You couldn’t have said it better. #1 A proper engine tune is cleaner than the muffled, regulated, planned obsolence the government and manufacturers spew. # 2 The “Mainstream” media is just their puppet. Where are all the good journalist that have integrity to do the hard work right ?

    • The whole thing is about emissions, right?? Why then when I get 18% better fuel economy and no emissions from DEF , I’m still classed as a law breaker????? . The bottom line is that it’s a cash cow for Oil companies and the government, period.

  • First off I would like to enforce the fact that I am all in favor of a greener environment. I sincerely believe if you are not a part of the solution, you are a part of the problem! So if I remove a DPF for a customer saving him potentially thousands in repairs and downtime does that make me a good guy or hypocrite?

    I bring this up on the heels of H&S Performance volunteering to temporarily halt the sale of select products while in discussion with EPA. For those of you that do not know who H&S are… H&S Performance IMO makes the highest quality after-market diesel engine performance electronics in the market and their support is second to none! Not all H&S products are designed for performance only, some if not all increase the engines efficiency and fuel economy. Equally important they allow the consumer to temporarily disable the truck’s emission system

  • I have a 2009 westernstar with 475 twin turbo cat.My DPF is constantly acting up putting on check engine light on and derating me which in tern is affecting my driving time resulting in more down time.i recently just put new art head on it at a cost of around 1600.00 and honestly ive had it with it…I never even had it a year yet…I wonder if the government will subsidize my downtime and lost revenue not likely….

      • I have a ’08 Pete also, C15 Acert Twin Turd. I’m on my 2nd ARD, and just put a new coil on it this week. Now they say spark wasn’t getting to the ARD igniter spark plug. I’m at $12,000 in 18 months in repair parts and labor. Then I have the 4.8 MPG issue, and thats being loaded only 50% of the time. Been kicked off two very good jobs because the truck cannot perform. Then I see older trucks running up and down I5 in California all day long because now its been discovered that CARB has no authority whatsoever to pull over trucks and conduct inspection because they are not CHP, CHP Employees, or Law Enforcement. So I bought a new truck for nothing. Bankruptcy here I come….

        • Take your truck to PDI in St George UT, cost me 4500.00 but I left their shop at near 700hp and 7 mpg on a Pete car hauler. That CAT twin turbo is unreal when tuned properly.

  • My 2013 Volvo I bought in March 2013. Since beginning of winter I started to have problems with DPF. Engine codes lights up when I am between Whitehorse and Grande Prairie. Bu the time I am back to Calgary, codes disappear. So, from December 2013 to March 28 2014 I had THREE new DPF filters installed. And not last I would say. Because of that I was out of work for 5 weeks in 4 months. I got the lemon.

  • Diesel particulate matter is freakin nasty stuff!
    Unlike gasses, this stuff falls to the ground and makes everything dirty & gets into groundwater.. plus it’s a carcinogen to boot.
    If you want your kids to live in the dark & wet Blade Runner world in the future.. well delete them…
    Emerging technologies take time to develop and perfect, but a DPF is a pretty simple concept.. it’s like a sponge catching the unburned diesel particles. Where you run into problems is when they get clogged. How fast they clog varies based on usage, short trips with lots of starts & stops or idling will clog faster than longer trip units that get up to heat.
    Regardless of how they clog, the simple solution is to unclog them…get them cleaned before they cause problems. Make it part of your regular maintenance like changing air & oil filters (much greater intervals though).
    A clean DPF vs dirty will generally get you back 5% fuel economy or more.
    If you read your manual it’ll tell you when it should be cleaned and then factor in things like above to determine best intervals.
    There’s another misconception that you don’t have to clean DPF’s if you run DEF fluid. DEF fluid actually doesn’t clean DPF’s, it’s injected into the exhaust after the DPF/DOC before the muffler.

    • my husband does that and the system still clogs and is making us broke he has a peterbelt 2008 paccar px8 since he has bought this piece of shit he has been losing money and he had to get rid of his 96 international that was getting 7miles to the gallon and now he is lucky if he gets 4.5 this whole carb compliant is crap and hurting everyone.

      • Same shit here too px8 70k miles 3sets of injectors 4turbos 1egr valve 1egr cooler various sensors I got so disgusted I retired 2years earlier than I planned shame on these companies that use the owners as Ginny pigs this junk should never have left the drawing board!!! Oh now my laptop won’t let me comment because nitomike@gmail and niromike isn’t my correct email but it is????

    • Rider Rider I think you should stop reading those owner’s manual, and stick your nose in my DPF world for a while. I’ve had my fine piece of cummins thecnology for almost 6 years now never deleted nothing. I’m up to 50,000 $ in dpf and egr maintnance and cleaning bullshit now. So when you take your nose out of my DPF little world pick up the tab for any egr part or sensor that may fail tomorrow and screw up the new DPF I just installed. Thanks in advance for your concern on the planet bill. 🙂

      • Hahaha that was awesome
        I am sure rider rider needs a new dpf system installed in his brain maybe he can make more sense.

    • In Jan this year I bought a 2008 Cascadia from Freightliner after had previously owned a 2000 Century and a 2002 Columbia (Both Paid Off).
      The reason why was because Califormia was enforcing this new law that was supposed to be in effect this same year…thing is old trucks still entering CA and I’m here stuck with a monthly payment for the next 2 1/2 years and having problems.
      Mr Rider the truck’s DFF filter was removed, inspected and cleaned, It did help a little but I’m not happy yet the performance of the truck, this truck was not made for stop and go traffic…they really suck!
      My previous trucks at every IFTA averaged above 6.5 MPG driving at 70-73 and idling all night when cold or hot weather, this truck hardly gets me 5.5 mpg driving aroung 65 mph and as little idling asl possible.
      So I have the clean idle sticker on my door but afraid to let it idle not to mess up my DPF filter!!!
      I even became a member at different truckers sites to read and find information about engine codes since I got myself in this mess but hey I’m in complience with CA clean air regulations 🙁

    • You don’t know what the hell you’re talking about. I had my entire DPF system taking apart cleaned and put back together the next day the lights on the dashboard read high soot level. I did a manual regen and it has been running 4 hours today. what is it actually cleaning, nothing. There is no soot to catch or clean. All of these systems are not just junk but they are a scam. Of course while you’re driving or idling it calculates all of that and then generates code and then Derate engine so you can bring it in for service. The entire Enterprise is a f*cking scam

    • The problem is know one knows (dealer or shops) how to effectively diagnose what the problem is and an Owner Operator quickly runs out of money trying to maintain the legal emission controls system.

      Manuals rarely help truckers, they need to be told and show how these systems are supposed to work, how to maintain and how to trouble shoot these systems. No offences but this is typically how truckers communicate. Word of mouth.

      Truckers risk bankruptcy tying to maintain these systems. Down time not hauling during the fix = no $ coming in. Plus the fix that does not work = $ out. And then further down time – no $ coming in…

      A starting trucker cannot afford a new truck and has to run through 2 or 3 second hand trucks to get to that point. So better emissions technology is a long way off for them.

      The legislation and the technology are not aligned with reality of the economics of the operator. I feel this is a problem on both sides of the Canada-US border. Now I like to breath clean air too. But something has to change to improve a truckers ability to earn a fair living. In my opinion they have been tossed under their own wheels on this one.

  • I have a ’07 Cat Acert C15, constantly in the shop, 4.9 mpg, its always sensors this and sensor that problems which cost about $1000 each time, new ARD installed last week $2200. Add all this up with the down time, poor fuel economy, and you can see its a matter of time before I’m broke.

    • What you should get is heavy houl software from cat and high flow muffler, after that you should never have a problem. I done all my trucks and mpg went from 5.5 to 7.25 constet

  • Does anyone know how to get in on the class action lawsuits against Cats Acert engine that are out there? I heard that there a 6 of them and Cat is trying to get them all consolidated into one suit.

    • Hi TruckMatt

      I have been researching some of the issues you have been talking about for a potential class action and I would really like to hear more about your story. If you are interested in telling us more, please contact me at ontariolaw86@gmail.com.

    • I got signed up on the class action suit with a law group that went ahead and took my info but he said because I bought the truck used (400,000 miles) I may not be eligible for damages. The Attorney is Paul M. Weiss, Complex Litigation Group, 513 Central Ave, Suite 300, Highland Park, Illinois 60035. Contact them and see if they can add you onto the lawsuit.

    • we have a lot problem with volvo 2011 D13 i want be involve in class actions suit i dont know how i conectet with grup

  • My 2010 Volvo D13 with DEF keeps derating the engine. I am yet to see a month without MIL or the codes or both. Slowly making me bankrupt. Is there a class action against Volvo somewhere?

  • Engine derate was designed to make drivers compliant if 1) DEF tank is empty 2) DEF is of poor quality and 3) Driver tampers the SCR system.

    However, engine derate rarely happens due to drivers fault, in most of the cases, software derates the engine due to component failure considering it as a quality issue.

    EPA seems to have realized that it is not always the driver’s fault and exempted fire and emergency vehicle from derating.

    Why poor drivers are being sent to bankruptcy courts when the fault lies elesewhere.

    Is there anyone out there making manufacturers responsible why the piece of crap keep breaking?

  • I am a heavy duty tech in Alberta. Ten years as dealer service manager and now in sales. With that being said I was forced to fly the flag and support this technology. The bottom line is…… 1) I have seen numerous operators almost go broke with downtime. 2) This technology DOES not work in high idle time oilfield applications. OEM reps are full of shit if they say it does. 3) There is minimal warranty on the after treatment system. OEM’s offer poor warranty as there is a ton of problems. They don’t want to go broke. EXAMPLE… Had a customer way up north on a Vac truck job. 1200 RPM does not create the heat for regens in -30 C. Truck goes into derate mode. Guy can’t drive home. Lucky he did not freeze to death. $12000 tow bill to dealership. SURPRISE.. no warranty due to high idle time. Had to replace DPF, catalyst, and ERG cooler. He got to pay that as well. Zero support. No factory reps cared because this is the law? BS! Now lets talk environmental. These engines burn more fuel, cost is higher, and have a lot more junk on them that has to be manufactured. MANUFACTURING is the biggest environmental offender. The soot, ash, and garbage components end up in a landfill. Go poor yourself a glass of clean water all you people who support this.

    • Hello Glitch.
      My name’s Bob and I’ve just read your comment dates Nov.27,2014.
      My wife and I would have some questions regarding those issues, as my wife has suffered chemical poisonning (4 double pneumonias) related to DPF/EGR .She’s been off work since March 2014.

      Please reply,wether you agree to answer or not.

  • The fact of the matter is, if these DPF, EGR, and DEF systems actually worked as they are supposed to then there wouldn’t be an issue. But as someone else mentioned, if they were properly tested before being installed on trucks and farm equipment then the manufacturers would see the JUNK they are putting on our vehicles. I am a farmer, and we bought a new combine last year that has a DPF and DEF system on it. It eventually got to a point where we couldn’t run an entire day without being down due to problems with the emissions systems on a combine with LESS THAN 100 HOURS ON IT. It cost us a ton of money in repairs and downtime, as well as crops being lost due to the weather getting bad before we got a chance to get to them. Also a neighbor of mine has a JD s680 combine with the DPF system on it and we watched it burn up in the field on its FIRST REGEN due to the high temperatures and all the dust that’s involved with harvesting. He now has a new machine that is fully deleted and tuned and he says it was the best investment he ever made. IMO, these sort of things should not be implemented on the equipment that we RELY on for our farms survival. It has cost us thousands that we will never get back and even if it functioned properly it still costs more money to have it serviced and buy the DEF and other things that go with it. All that being said, all of our diesel pickups have been fully deleted and tuned and all of our semis are pre-emissions trucks and have NO problems out of them besides the normal wear and tear that’s on any vehicle.

  • Regarding the pre-emissions semis we own, as soon as one of them bites the dust i can guarantee I will be rebuilding them myself instead of trading them in on newer style post emissions versions. After the nightmares we have experienced with our tractors and combines it just wouldn’t make sense for me to spend more money on something i know doesn’t work. I will stick to the “tried and true” way of doing things until the EPA drives us into the ground!

  • Was into buying a new truck but reading all the bad things about DPF,EGR and DEF SYSTEMS won’t be having any part of it.

    • Joe, don’t buy a new truck until these junk systems are fixed. I am going broke, everyone that is refusing to comply are still running. I just did a trip to So Cal and there are older trucks running everywhere. A friend of mine was stopped and they just gave him a flyer telling him he “need” to get entered into the system, he tossed it out the window!

  • We ordered school bus for American Samoa students. The International Maxxforce Engine Diesel. Its last than a year and we are having problems with the DPF system. The stop engine light keep coming on and based on the trouble code (3936 DPF pressure out of range). The DPF light for regeneration did not come on. As I read through all the comments it seems as if I we have the same problem. We live south of the equator and the cost of cleaning these dpf filter is just haywire. Please I really need help with fixing these school buses. I need suggestions with these type of buses, I’m ordering the same 10 buses. Our speed limit is 25mph. I really need suggestions about this type of engines.

  • Reading the comments following your article should give you an idea of the REAL problem. I know your magazine is heavily financed by manufacturers so this might be hard for you to openly admit.

    The market will eventually correct itself.

    EVERYONE wants clean air, efficiency, yadda, yadda.

    The REAL PROBLEM is that all the manufacturers having their DEFECTIVE TECHNOLOGY REMOVED sold DEFECTIVE PRODUCTS. Some, such as International in the USA, are being sued.

    Cummins and all the rest need to be sued also because they have the same/ similar problems (read DEFECTS).

    The REAL SOLUTION would be to make the MANUFACTURERS OF THESE DEFECTIVE PRODUCTS recall their crap and fix it. Truckers and trucking companies are going out of business because of DEFECTIVE PRODUCTS that are always in the shop. The good news I guess is that parked trucks make 0 pollution. However, they also produce 0 revenu, even worse they suck the driver/ owner dry but produce nothing but headaches and BILLS.

    These DEFECTS were hidden and/or denied when the DEFECTIVE PRODUCT was sold. These problems are still denied despite EVERYONE EXPERIENCING THEM, and the costs of correcting and/or sustaining this DEFECTIVE TECHNOLOGY is being passed on to the unsuspecting victims: the owners. These owner victims are often told they are doing something wrong, it is somehow their fault.

    I noticed no one is “modifying” Freightliner Cascadia trucks. Daimler seems to have produced the MOST EFFICIENT and COST EFFECTIVE engine.

    Many companies I know are switching to these trucks and letting all those you mentioned go at GREAT LOSSES. They are all DEFECTIVE. I could and should use more explicit terms, but I won’t. Read the comments following your article.

    Navistar has several lawsuits against them so far, but I know Cummins and the others you mentioned ALL have SERIOUS PROBLEMS. They were ALL sold under false pretenses: that the DEFECTIVE TECHNOLOGY actually worked. It doesn’t. And THEY, (the delinquent manufacturers), not the unsuspecting victim/ consumer should be responsible for CORRECTING THE MANUFACTURER’S MISTAKES and paying and paying and paying these people to fidle with DEFECTIVE TECHNOLOGY they themselves have not figured out how to fix/ correct.

    All the manufacturers you mentioned need to be held accountable for the DEFECTIVE TECHNOLOGY they produced.

    Recalls are in order and THEY NEED TO FIX IT AT THEIR COST, or they need to be sued, or they need to go out of business by losing all their clients who WILL PURCHASE technology that does work.

    Class-action lawsuit accuses Navistar of knowingly selling defective engines.


    Rick Blatter

  • I’ll admit, after reading the above comments I think I’ve done better than most. But I’ve still had enough for my taste. I work in the oil field of alberta and I’m thankfull because I would have lost my truck a long time ago if not for my high wages. Over 30000 in repairs in the last 3.5 years. Not to mention 3.5 to 4.5 MPG US. Between repairs, downtime and fuel mileage I figure I’m working over a month a year to pay for the clean air coming out of my stacks. If I don’t drive with a code up and the check engine light on I don’t work. I dive a 2011 Volvo with a 500hp D13 engine. I’m rebuilding a 97 freightliner with a cat 3406 engine. And when it’s done I’ll be putting my Volvo to the side as a spare truck because I know if I sell it, it’s just going to become someone else’s problem. It’s criminal what they did to us with these engines. I’ll be making 6 more payments on it after I take it off the road. And I’ve only got 533774 Kms on it. Its just too expensive to operate and it makes me look unreliable cause I break down at the drop of a hat. I’d like to join any lawsuits against Volvo. If anyone knows of one please email me at stevenstrath1975@hotmail.com

  • Here is my story with DEF. I bought 7 F350 for oil and gas hotshot. All were brand new straight from dealer. 2 of them within the first year and less than 100000 miles wont run and the dealer has had them for over 60 days and 4 times. Cant file lemon law because we bought them under our business name. Still have to make the monthly payment though. The dealer unoffically said delete the def/dpf because I have already spent 1/2 of what I paid for brand new trying to fix these piles of crap. 1 other one will only get 3.5 mpg Now I bought 2 Peterbilt 579 with cummins ISX. Now they want a complete DPF, VOC, SCR replacement whcih is not covered by warranty for $10000 and I have not even driven it enough to be due for the first oil change yet. This is unproven technologyforcing small companies out of business. How is it cleaner when you burn more fuel and get worse fuel mileage and have to build all of the extra parts. This is a scam plain and simple.

  • I see this is about semis but wondering if others are having the same issues with ag equipment? We’ve asked around but according to the dealer we are the only ones having issues with our tractor. We’ve had to replace every component of the DEF system on our tractor. It’s destroying us. At least we were able to have it removed from our 2013 KW. If anyone knows of any class action lawsuits against CASE IH and their tractors, I’d like to know. Bcf@inet2000.com

  • my2014 pete 389 w/isx 15 since april has been nothing but a friggen headache derating on a daily basis, def codes popping up and now a new one, stop engine light, which limits you to 10 kph so can’t even properly limit the thing to a repair place. what I would like to see is engine companies be held accountable for this crap, pay lost revenue, towing and all repairs to these failed emissions systems, then maybe they would get their shit together and get it right. so far as I can tell the only ones making any money at this game is the mechanical shops, doing the repairs at $160/hr, which ironically is more than I get for my truck when it is running properly, very tempted to sell my new truck and buy a pre-emission one like I had, could have rebuilt that engine already with what down time has cost me, and still had a reliable, fuel efficient unit that would go everyday without question. getting very frustrated, a guy buys new equipment to avoid this kind of crap not to be handed a heaping helping of it on a gold platter. enuff is enuff EPA and engine manufacturers will you kindly pull your collective heads outta your asses and get shit done right, make something that works the way its intended to or but the hell out.

    • Holler at jake Kithers , he saved all of my Cummims ISX trucks, I was about ready to sell the rigs before that .

  • Problem here is companies unwilling to pass on the environmental costs to the consumer. Truckers that are deleting egr/dpf/def systems are breaking the law and allowing for an industry to operate at a false cost of business. If everyone had to deal with the new systems costs/breakdowns it would be a level playing field and the price of shipping goods by truck would certainly go up. Instead the industry insists on breaking the laws to keep costs down.
    So your average trucker is now left with several options:
    Stick to older equipment and deal with the hassle/costs involved there or buy new equipment and break the law to stay competitive.
    You cant really expect anyone to operate new equipment in this lawless unenforced environment and stay in business for long
    Frankly the blame lies 100% on the government and their piss poor management of everything.

  • DEF is one of worst ideas yet in the trucking industry. I run an 04 Freightliner. I don’t have the issues with it like my fellow truck owners who run newer DEF trucks. I will not buy a DEF truck. This is just one more BS regulation that with All the new BS regulations will eventually all but shut down the trucking industry. When that happens our country will see another huge economic disaster. Keep the trucks rolling keep our economy rolling .. Shut us down and the economy will go with it.

  • I work in the heavy truck delete industry and have done quite a few deletes for truckers who are having problems with their emission systems. One of the biggest factors that drives our customers to us is the cost of maintaining their EGR and DPF systems. This especially applies to those who buy a truck second hand.

    The fact is, a lot of people don’t take care of their emission systems for the first few hundred thousand kilometres / miles and as a result, EGR systems become plugged up with particulate or carbon deposits and DPF filters get backed up with ash. By keeping these trucks on the road with the bare minimum maintenance they end up de-rating and spending more time in the shop than doing what they were made for. Although I agree that deletes aren’t the best solution for drivers, for many truckers they are very necessary and in many cases, they actually decrease the amount of emissions that are released into the atmosphere. The biggest thing to keep in mind is that if an engine can breathe properly, it will more than likely operate more efficiently.

  • Bought a fleet, that I would rather burn to the ground.

    International Maxxforce 9, 2008.
    Engine, DPF, and EGR problems without letup.

    If there was a delete for this Motor, I would do it.
    I cant afford to solve my problem like Mr. Elwood Rines and upgrade, as we run 5 year municipal contracts.

    Heres a link to a class action lawsuit against the Maxxforce jerks.


  • Industrial lobby play with you fulls, they want you to pay for everything. In Europe good stuff is working from years without problems. American manufactures making experiments and as they agreed with governments USA CA for showing every year new progress regarding cleaner exhaust gasses. It is crap ..adopt what is in Eu and is done. DD15/16 – Mercedes no problem in EU, Paccar – DAF no problem in EU and Volvo America – FH 12/16 no problems in EU and so on … Scum bags lobby and government sucks ours money and pretend they do something about it, so naive. Finally next year they gonna put system which is working in EU since a decade. Holly molly … Business lady’s and gentlemen`s pharmacological, weapon, transport milliards of dollars from You to them

  • I just got the delete on my 08 volvo d13 engine but if u have isx and want to save money all u need to is open the filters drill them out make a hole as big as a mufler pipe u have put it back in make sure u put new seals and shot it off manualy inside the truck and never have problems again!!!! U will have orange Check engine litght on but who cares…. It will save u thousands

  • He we go again. It’s nearly September 2015 and nothing has changed. I’ve broken down at the Flying J in Sioux Falls SD. Took the truck to the local dealer. He’s quoted me near $14,000 in parts plus labour to renew the complete DPF System on my 09 Volvo VNL 780 D13.
    The system was cleaned last February at a cost of near $2000.
    I am going bankrupt with the incessant repairs to the exhaust gas system and relevant sensors, codes being thrown, faulty wiring harness, etc etc.
    I need advice please, a DPF delete shop in the Sioux Falls area. Any suggestions ?

  • My 08 Pete with an ACERT SDP dpf has cost me almost 50k in 18 months. It is parked. When it is paid off it will get rebuilt. The dpf egr (cgi) deleted. Carb can kiss my ass! This is government intervention at it’s best. They have ruined me and many others. This is criminal. Our government needs to be over thrown. They can print more money when ever they need it. I can’t. They would incarcerate me if I tried. We have a crooked government. They need to be stopped!

    • Hi Dave, I empathize with your emissions problem, but not sure that an insurrection is the answer. 2008 was a particular bad year for this technology as you well know. What about the manufacturer, no satisfaction from them?

      • Harry,
        We really appreciate this article…we are a California based diesel technology company but see the same problems as you guys are seeing. Fortunately we have developed an EPA and CARB compliant solution that reduces the maintenance issues related to the after-treatment system and improves efficiency, reliability, and fuel economy.
        We are trying to get the word out because the industry needs our help…unfortunately many truckers are so jaded about new products with ridiculous claims that we are immediately pigeon-holed as another “snake oil” company. Meanwhile, we are in the initial stages of a providing CARB with a formal pilot study of our service through CalTrans, so we are clearly not trying to skirt regulation.
        We welcome writers like yourself, and publications like TruckNews to look into us and decide for yourself if Lloyd Diesel is really the solution that we claim to be. Please, please check us out and contact me so I can send you more information.
        Thank you for your hard work and effort to bring to light these troubling issues our industry is facing.

    • You have hit the nail on the head. Government. Engine company’s are trying to stay in business just like us. It’s GOVERNMENT that set these standards.

  • Thank you, “Truck news”, for the “Support”. I’m the bad person, because I try to survive. Every 6-8th month I’m in the some shop in north America to change the: ARD, Spark plug, coil, spark plug cable and bla-bla-bla stuff (don’t forget the labor) on my truck, which cost me a thousands dollars (over 6 thousand, every time) and downtime of 1-2-3 or even more weeks. So if you are in my shoes, what you gone a do?

  • I am an o/o don’t have the cash to pay for repairs that my old truck never asked for. Rates have not increased but maintainance cost has double. I do believe in maintaining the environment cleaner but as soon as I’m done paying for my truck I will start looking for an older model without emissions restrictions

  • I have 2009 peterbilt and have a problem with my DPF I have been going to the shop almost every week.Please I need a shop which can help remove the DPF and the electronics with it.
    HELP ME. I Live in New Jersey

    • jakekithers@yahoo.com
      He is the best at ecm tuning and he does all makes & models. He’s saved several of our trucks and saved us a lot of cash. He always returns our call or email asap and gets us taken care of. Very knowledgeable too

  • I have a 2015 Freightliner. As I am typing this I have 48,617.9 Km. I purchased the truck brand new just over a year ago. I live with the check engine light on. Fault code 3382 due to EGR issues. 94 times this fault code has come up. I have tried to remain compliant but I can see why guys are deleting stuff that doesn’t work. I am going to be on that band wagon very soon. It is a great idea in theory but when you are in the shop every week for the same problem and nobody cares about your down time and lost revenue something has to change.

  • We have two 2008 Mack Granites with MP8 motors. Our problems are the same as every one else . Constant codes ,Constant derating.
    I am in country Western Australia can anyone give me some info on how to delete the EGR etc.

  • I have a 2 -2008 c-15 Cat SDP. I use to replace the ARD head every 9 months I pay for it every other time because they never last more than a year. So the dealer covers it every other time. Cost aside (between $2000-$3500) and trying to find a dealer that won’t rape you on price and tell that they can’t get your truck in the shop for 10 days to do something that takes 3-4 hours I don’t care what any of these people say…..they never worked properly. I was meticulous in keeping up with the maintenance ( getting them cleaned every year not every 200,000 miles installing new plugs in the ARD head at every other oil change. Only buying fuel at big chains). THEY DONT WORK 2 years ago I ponied up the 3500 on each truck for the delete kits. I have not been in a shop since PERIOD. I’ve increased fuel mileage from 5.4 to 6.3, the truck runs cooler and Passes the emission tests every year PUTTING OUT THE EXACT SAME EMISSIONS as they did before installing the delete kit For anyone thinking about doing it the are many tuners out there in all 50 states. You just need to do your research and find them a lot of mechanics are doing it. It was the beast decision I ever made. I don’t feel guilty about the environment because I’m putting out the same emissions as I did before except now I’m using less fuel. I would have probably gone out of business if I didn’t get them deleted.

  • hi
    you got so much covered, don’t you see every single truck that is equipped with DPF Since it came in 2007 had and are having problems with the system… Why don’t you write an article about the Truck Manufacturing Companies how they are ripping thousands of people and there’s not even a single recall despite so many problems.
    Truck dealers are making so much money out of this DPF cos outside mechanics don’t have codes and dealers are supper expansive. i can Guarantee you there is not a single dealer in Canada who has 100% knowledge of system they all follow Flow Chart to deal the problem (hook computer and follow instructions step by step…. in case something goes wrong follow step 1 again)
    i am surprised why no one is Suing them

    Pls Visit us on face book
    After Treatment Problems

  • Harmeet. Do you have a FIX solution for DPF, . Or know where I can find a shop that will FIX this problem for good. , Thanks

    • Email jakekithers@yahoo.com,
      That guy is the best at tuning ECMs . I know he does CAT, Cummins , Mack, Detroit, Volvo, International, Paccar just to name a few. He takes care of our fleet & it’s never ran better. He always will return your call asap too.

  • Hey califirnia…Im an over the road trucker ..Ive ran over the road for 8 years…Let me tell you this…Your speed limit dose not solve emmishions problems…In Fact it makes it worse…let me explain…a truck running 80 miles an hr up a mountian grade puts out less emmishions than a truck running 55….Truck a runs 55 gets 1 quorter the way up the grade…and now is stuck at 30 mph all the way up the upgrade….Gess what the slow truck is puttung out 3 times the immessions….because it is thir 3 times as long than the other truck….so infact you are doing more damage to the environment….than a truck that runs normal speeds…You are the problem not the truck…And Thats 8 years of experience that no amout of test you run will not prove it….ok you have truck B he runs at 80 miles an hr towards the same upgrade….he gets halfway up because of his speed…then drops 70 60 55 hit the top….Guess what…He did not put out more than 10% emmishions..because his motor ran hot and burned up the emmishions because the terbo didnt kick in as much….He cleared the area….Ok truck A is still there his terbo kicked in….he has 30 miles to run at 25 mph….That truck just choked the hell out of the enviroment….You created the problem….The 80 mile an hr truck is gown 30 minutes ago…….the 55 mile an hr truck is still there choking the hell out of the enviroment….and its burning more fuel….i run coast to coast weekly..i know the us like the back of my hand…..you are ruining the environment with your 55 mile an hr crap….This is experience talking…not just assumption…Im also certified autobody teck…and i tell you these mechanicks bypassing your immishions system is right on….Good Day!!!!

  • As a diesel mechanic with 30 years in the business ,I feel bad for our industry. Government mandated regulations have caused / forced engine emission standards to be implemented too soon. This technology is horrible. Derate should not be allowed. Warranty coverage should be just like autos. Based on average mileage over the life of the vehicle. Over the road trucks Warranty should then be 10 years 500.000 miles. Extended warranty to 1 million miles. Otherwise this unreliable ,ultra expensive, poor quality parts, should not be allowed to be installed on ANY engine until it is proven. Virtually every item we have was transported by truck.The trucking industry is the heart of this country. I see problems everyday related to emmision faults. It is costing company’s big and small a fortune. I wish I had the solution , other than the DELETE option. Every truck I repair, I honestly say to myself. I wonder what will fail next.

  • Hello
    I have International ProStar with MaxxForce13 engine this truck killing me slowly i see some people doing modification to system there are some additives to clean system please folks shear some light who and where can help me

  • The best solution to the problem is to stop buying the new equipment. I have a 2012 with a DD15 motor. My DPF system is screwing up and has cost me nearly $4k over the last 2 months. Recently the engine lights have come back on and went off. I don’t know what I am going to do, but when the truck is paid off all of this CRAP is going to be removed, by-passed, or replaced.

    • I work in delete industry, and I can tell You for sure that Detroit Diesel engines have the most problems. Those DD15 engines are junk! When you do delete, avoid adding power, because those engines crack cylinders even when they are stock. More power will just make that happen sooner.

  • We have a 2013 Western Star tridrive tractor with a dd15. Put a Stienbaur power box on it at 100000 kms because the so called 560 hp engine wouldn’t pull the hat off your head.This was the best thing to put on the dd15 ever the power was there when you needed it fuel mileage was up all was good until the dpf plugged up 7.Instead of paying the outrageous price for the filter we decided on a delete .The first partial delete was a big mistake now we’ve done the full delete ,changed turbo ,manifolds and got rid of all the crap so as you can actually see the engine .Runs much better and the Stienbaur still works only problem is the Jake no longer works on high position and no one seems to have the answer.

  • I’m an old school trucker & now I am over a fleet of about 40 trucks. For Mack, Cat, Cummins, Detroit, International, Paccar, Volvo, Volvo Loaders, Mercedes ect we reccomend Jake Kithers. He has always taken care of our ecm needs and knows what it takes to keep you on the road trucking. He’s done all of our Kenworths & Peterbilts and done many others for friends of mine in the trucking business. By far the most dependable tuning expert. His email is
    jakekithers@yahoo.com and his number is 940-353-7278. I wouldn’t reccomend anyone else and if you need him tell him Jay Wright sent you.

  • the bottom line is the OEM’s are making too much money from DEF and other related issues. if the costs of repairs were affordable and reasonable then no one would tamper. but with the cost of a single sensor beings 100’s of bucks not including down time. why would one want to keep it. plus then your engine only allows you to travel along a 5 mph. what F—ing good is that.

  • I replaced my 2003 Columbia with a 2014 KW T660, now 6months later, lost my home last week, had only 3 yrs left to pay it off. I’m basically stranded every other week along with the down time costs in repairs etc I’m basically bankrupt. Dealers don’t really help they just nickel n dime me one by one as i travel along my way. Along w DOT’s and brokers also trying to do the same, this really saddens me brings tears to my eyes as i having to tell my kids n wife we have to move out because we lost our home, I’m in dept with maintenance for that new truck etc, I’m trying here to simply survive now. Before w my other truck which i bought 7yrs ago w 280,000 and died on me w 1,790 never had any major repairs. Just one turbo and 1 water pump 1 alternator other than reg maintenance. This newer truck in less than 5 months basically destroyed me. Also saw how some small fleets went belly up due to these epa regulations. It really saddens me how certain people are willing to do this and argue it’s all good as they profit off the hard work of truckers trying to simply make ends meet and it only seems to be getting worse. I’m still trying to keep strong and have faith, but lately it’s been very hard, i would delete that system but too broke to even afford it, probably losing truck soon at these rate, although losing that truck was the 1st thing i should had done 1st month i got it, i simply trusted that it was a new vehicle and was blind to even imagine a new truck being so unreliable and now that i see it, it’s not the case of me just getting a bad truck, they’re all bad if they have that epa forced equipment. As of right now i have 2 trips straight w out any problems, i simple diconnected the egr valve in an act of desperation, check engine is on also noticed more use of def but truck is running like never before, feels very strong also went from 6mpg to 8mpgs on both loads, now on 3rd one truck seems to be doing unbelievably great. God Bless and good luck to everyone hope things get better for all us truckers out there.

  • Have a 2014 pete cummins isx 525 bought new in march 2013 Had all the usual problems with the DPF, warranty ran out at 403000 km and had to rebuild engine at 407000 was pulled over this week buy moe(ministry of environment because my stack was dirty and always has been even with the dpf, have 10 days to have a shop prove its all in working order has anyone gone through this wondering what my opions are

    • after the rebuild I did what a lot of others have done to protect my investment and it’s never run better, all the power I could want and have never broken down since plus getting 7mpg at 3,90 gears hauling heavy

  • this clean air bullshit has been nothing but just that.it ran the cost of trucks up by up to 2o % higher and the cost of down time and repair costs through the roof.we have to buy 15 trucks to keep 10 on the job.Its become a major expense that the truck owners cant continue to absorb with the truck brokers setting rates so low you have to be an outlaw to be a trucker and the shop costs are throught the roof.Everyone in this industry is making money except the dumbass trucker who gets it in the rear.

  • No matter how good you maintain your dpf egr urea systems, they always seem to have problems. i’ve been running a fleet of cummins, and paccars mx13 and it has been nothing but trouble for me. contstant regens, constant derates, constant visits to dealerships – it has been a nightmare, and almost lead us to bankruptcy.
    so we decided to give it a try with a delete, and it helped us a lot.
    we didnt get any power upgrade, stayed at same, and for 2 years all ready, all engines are running with 0 problems. oil is cleaner, no derate issues, no expensive dealer’s fees to “clean the dpf”.

  • For what it’s worth,, I’m saddened to say,, after 35 years as an O/O and 5 years as a company driver before that, this new and improved equipment that has dominated the market and made everyone but a truck driver rich and famous is shameful. I’m “Old School”, so when committed to somthing , I follow through with the deal. My 2008 Volvo 780 purchased from Arrow Truck Sales in Mississauga is now paid off, but with the tune of $122,000.00 in repairs and maintenance all directly related to the DPF and EGR systems. I do feel for each and every one of you that have felt like you’ve been taken advantage of by the white collar bureaucrats who just want to have there 15 minuts of fame and not think of the repercussions of their actions or decisions. Like my Daddy said, ” Walk a mile in our shoes, then sleep on it before you make any stupid decisions” So .. Question ? ,, if anyone cares to answer. How does it benifit our environment when all that nasty carbon that is caught up in a filter is then , at usually the most inconvenient times , required to be removed from the vehicle for the famous “Shake and Bake” . These ovens use vast amounts of energy to chang the composition of the contaminants to be discarded through the chimney and in the trash bin, mind you , at a substantial fee. So, your supposedly “enviromentaly freindly” but at what cost to you, and are you realistically part of the solution or part of the problem ?
    Sorry for any spelling errors.

  • I like how the author of this article write that the emissions from the deleted units still MEET or exceed the regulated requirements then goes on to complain that we are back to 2002 emissions. So Mr Rudolfs how can they still meet today’s emission requirements and be producing emissions like back in 2002? I have a 2016 KW and am running in the mountains and hills a lot I will be deleting that garbage in the next 2 months because at $0.80/l up to $1.20/l and a reduced fuel mileage of 1.5 to 2 MPG its increasing my operating costs for fuel and DEF by 5-7% combined with a slow economy and reduced rates for loads my fuel costs have jumped from 12-13% to 20-22% so if I can get my fuel expense down to 15% it will mean an extra $2000-4000 profit each month for me. Running methanol injection will further reduce fuel costs and emissions so where is the benefits in all this emissions bull they force the manufacturers to implement?

  • egr cooler leaks were a damn nightmare for me. it’s been leaking like crazy on almost all our cummins engines. later the dpfs started cause issues, then i decided to try a delete on one of them. been running that truck for months, and 0 problems, mpg was up, it was running perfect. then i did all 7 of them, and a year later i have no issues.
    i am planning to do my mack too, with the same delete company.
    i got all the infos i needed, and i can for sure recommend them.
    their web page is http://www.truckecmtunes.com
    just tell them Allan from FL recommended them

  • Has anyone had a EGR DPF delete yet and would like to share their experience.
    I’m on a 2008 Cascadia DD14 with the above mentioned system parts and it’s been a nightmare lately, from day one when I bobtailed home from dealership I checked fuel consumpion and realized that she wasn’t going to be a fuel saver, I only got 7.3 MPG!, now three years later and with a remaining balance of 7 grand I wish I’ve never sold my 02 Series 60 truck, What a huge mistake!!

  • I bought a 2015 western star with the DD16 and it was a great truck and still is for the bed truck work I do in the oilpatch. This year it has been in the shop several times for the emissions system errors related to the DEF/SCR system. Particulate filter is a pain though too as I can’t leave the truck on high idle for extended periods on a site without it plugging up and wanting to do a regen. Warranty expires in April so will be looking to do a delete as well. Nothing wrong with clean air, but this system is not the way to do it. I get an average of 5mpg but it is a heavy truck so I understand that, but if I can get better mileage by burning less fuel, shouldn’t that be my contribution to a cleaner environment? Better reliability would be a further bonus as these systems cost so much in repairs in the long haul.

    • Iain
      if you do you will probably be joining me in jail as I just got pinched for doing the same thing to my Detroit, buy a glider kit and put a DD5 in it that’s what I should have done the only one winning now is my lawyer

  • We had 15 trucks and just closed down shop 3 months ago due to the amount of money we spent on DPF/ SCR issue. Spent close to 145k on issues with DPF, paccar stopped covering them after 100k/ 1 year. We’ve been in the trucking business for 20 years before this, 20 years!!!! Believe it. SCREW THE EPA. Family business gone to hell because we wanted to invest in new equipment.

    • I feel your anger Aaron, we bought 10 trucks, 2 weeks in and 4 are in the shop, $3600 to fix the first one.. nothing but headaches… we are either going to put older engines in the trucks or resell them and buy old trucks. This regen bs is too expensive.

  • Just try to hold my trailer which is a 26 foot travel trailer up the Coquihalla highway last week with my Ram 2500 series 6.7 liter turbo diesel and check engine light came on again for the fifth time in the last week… how to turn around at Bridal Falls British Columbia and spend the night….
    Luckily I was Towing my travel trailer so I slept in there went into Chilliwack the next day to O’Connor Chrysler to get my 8 Ram checked out for the check engine light…… how to drop my travel trailer outside of the dealership in order for it to go through their scan.. was told that they had started to take the truck apart but they didn’t have the turbo actuator module in stock and they didn’t have the gasket between the turbo housing and that they either had to bolt it back together or I have to wait 2 weeks for parts….. told them just to put everything back together was charged $320 for warranty work….. hold my trailer the next day up the Coquihalla highway using my OBD2 reader to erase the check engine code and eliminate the derate…. arrived in Edmonton a day and a half later for a 12-hour trip…. Derrick Dodge Chrysler performed a recall work and scr Catalyst removal and repair and replace on turbo actuator module work within 4 hours once I got here.. Ferry shuttle me for free both ways… probably did about $4,000 worth of work . Entire bill? $0 thank you Derek Dodge and hey Oconto Chrysler and Chilliwack get yourself some parts…… FedEx delivers them overnight

  • I want to by pass my adblue system i want to remove it and connect the exsost pipe with direct system . I dont need dpf system .. if i remove it can have an inpact on my engin???

  • A lot of people go for turbo deletes (VGT, or TwinTurbo to SingleTurbo conversions), according to tuning company recommendations – when doing deletes.
    That is completely unnecessary, you can get the delete done without doing the turbo delete.
    Doing the turbo delete will not help the fuel economy (usually can’t hurt it a lot), jakes will be weaker (Cummins ISX’s third stage is done with VGT).
    I found one company that was honest and told me all this, I’ve done quite a few deletes with them & it worked flawless.
    If you want, I can post their web site.

    Don’t get me wrong, I’ve done some turbo deletes as well, but it’s the fact that the truck can run perfect with no aftertreatment systems and with VGT turbo.

  • I have read all of these articles I truly feel as a business owner with the trucking industry and the problems that I myself have experienced from this issue we the people need to pull together and file a petition or contact the Better Business Bureau and file complaints on this situation in order for it to be resolved or at least in the hopes that something will be done We the People truly do need to come together to make a change with this one person cannot do it on their own

  • I agree with you I think Mr Trump’s been made aware of this kind of nonsense he might make the EPA get off the manufacturers backs but he in heradied such a bunch of problems !and for goodness sakes the nuts that blame him for every thing we need to quit letting the lefhwing loonies convince us all that the sky is falling??

  • Every truck i have had started with def issue costing thousands.and hours of down time. Im glad i dont own them !!! California also now says the def is kilking the environment more then the pre emissions.. so take them out.!

  • 2012 Pete 388 ISX15 engine
    Just one yr ago change a new STR cost $7500. Now one yr later DPS and DOC need to be change along with injectors and SCR cleaning cost $7200. I said NO Way i gonna paid this.
    Next week made an appoint with the mechanic to get rid off the def.
    Hope brighter days ahead of me?

  • 2012 GMC Duramax LML 6.6 Diesel 125500 km, right from day one the truck has had nothing but emissions equipment problems and cost are in the 10s of thousands in warranty repairs. If there was a way to measure pollution caused by the repair work done on these vehicles with SCR systems it would probably amount to more pollution, than if it didn’t have SRC systems. My warranty has timed out, so, I deleted the DPF, installed a muffler and tune. Knowing now that the SCR will not cause me any further issues, I can spend money on other things to protect and clean up the environment that have no repair cost to them.

  • The DPF and def systems are a total joke and a scam Not Just Junk. My system on my 2008 Volvo we’re constantly regenerating so I had the entire system taken apart and cleaned. Mind you there was very little suit in the system at all. I knew the technician personally so he let me watch and work on it so I was able to see exactly what was going on inside the catalytic converter. The next day the lights on the dashboard said that it had a high soot level, how is that possible? I’ll tell you how it, it’s not possible. The computer systems on a CMV especially with this new fake technology is designed to monitor you’re driving and then generate code based on how much driving you have done and then it derates your engine so it can be brought in for a service. The whole Enterprise is a con game and a scam.

  • I’m just wondering my husband drives and international and it seems like every week maybe once or twice a week they have to put the tractor in the shop because the Dpf system is lighting up and he can’t drive more than 8 kilometers an hour is there any suggestions that I could tell him thank you

  • the main problem with the emissions equipment and testing is that it’s done on a stationary vehicle to get the lowest numbers possible. problem is the equipment to get the low emissions output numbers at test chokes a diesel engine causing it to work harder at speed thus burning more fuel to go the same distance. An example i recently came across, although a gas engine but the same concept, compared a vehicle with an engine designed to run e85 gasoline blend. The study compared the emissions output running the prefered e85 versus 100% gasoline. At stationary testing the e85 produced less pollution but overall produced more pollution for the same distance driven than the 100% gasoline due to the fact that the e85 got worse fuel mileage.

    With egr and dpf choking diesel engines by creating increasing backpressures the fuel mileage goes down, not to mentionloss of power. We currently have multiple international 7400 dump trucks in the shop with dpf problems. last one of them I drove got so clogged it blew out a flex coupler and was blowing so much smoke a passer by could have assumed it was on fire as I creeped out the road at 5mph with foot to the floor. Oh and this was with less than 90,000 miles.

  • I’ve had problems with the Dpf system for 2 years. ISX Cummins 2014 Volvo 670. Repair bills have sucked me dry. The truck is still at the shop and Volvo can’t tell me whats wrong. I’ve paid almost $7K in repair bills on this Dpf system this year! sensors, cleaning, you need a clamp or your wire harness is faulty. 1 month later it happens again, more NH sensors, Nox sensors. The shop saying your filter is dirty it needs to be cleaned again. When does the bleeding stop? I’m all for deleting these bloodsuckers.

  • The ONLY thing we need to correct the unreliable emissions systems on trucks AND get clean air is this: EPA, REQUIRE that OEMs warranty emissions equipment for the life of the truck. 10 years, 750,000 miles is reasonable as that includes the first owner, major fleets and the second owner, first and second time owner operators who buy trucks in the 4 year old range with about 400,000 to 500,000 miles….you see, as a first time owner operator myself I could spend the $9000 Freightliner wants to replace my system on my 4 year old truck…by going into debt and then I am one small repair away form losing it all…OR (my choice) I can spend $2000 on a delete unit or reprogram and do some drilling in the DPF and BAM reliable! I also blocked the EGR (just disabled it, no need to block it on the cummins ISX as it stays closed when disabled. My truck went from 6.6mpg to 7.9. No poop. so smooth now and pulls harder and runs cooler. I just had the VGT turbo refitted with a NORMAL turbo too and thing pulls even better…no more BOOST at IDLE for gods sake because the ungine required boost at all times to stay running with all the back pressure it had to deal with. In addition, if the OEMs were required to warranty their equipment for the life of the truck how long before the figure out how to build the stuff more reliably? Right quick yassiree! Yea, as a Phoenix based driver who likes to get home every weekend and during the week it sucked giving up California runs but I found some nice runs to Colorado for the summer and Texas in the winter so I still running in the sun and getting paid…and guess what? My ISX which is built like a tank to withstand about 750,000 miles of non-stop heat and boost due to the previous emissions equipment will probably go 1 million miles now because in the last 110,00 miles since my delete, with over 580,000 on the truck, I have not been to the shop for a major breakdown. Just service and some brakes…life is good when maintenance costs are reasonable! I want clean air, I do. I love being able to stand next to my truck when all the emissions are working right and not even be able to smell the low mounted exhaust, but it is the MANUFACTURERS responsibility to pay for this new technology until they get it right, not the independents who made this country! Warranty the equipment and clean air is yours EPA…don’t and justify your failure to serve the people and instead serve the corporate overlords!

  • Well I’m also for clean air but not for the cost of private individuals. We can blame the big corporations much as we want. The government is in fault mainly. The manufacturers & dealers gaining also big money with these EPA changes don’t forget that also. So what it comes down to is the lobbyists who paid off a bunch of governors to support all this on it’s people. Regardless you are a truck driver or an individual owning any emission controlled vehicle we pay for the system before we buy it (added cost to manufacturing) and also after to service it. The government the only authority to give you a fine! Which is a BIG BS! They take the money from the lobbyist and they passing the bill (fine)to you again. Non of these representatives know anything about pollution ( not engineers) they mainly crooked lawyers taking legal bribes from big corporations to make their life better, not ours( they do not care about anything long as they can buy a new cottage or something else they think they need). It looks good on their achievement they supported the cleaner environment. Is it really? Absolutely not. Till we all be sheep’s on any level not just on this matter we always (the people)will pay the price. If some of you would organize a big shutdown (cross the country) on all transport for only two days which you could do! Instead of crying what you loose everyday. That would make them think twice! If nothing changes do it again and again. Until either they change the law or come up with a solution which is suitable for both sides not just for them( manufacturers and tree huger community)the minority in this industry but for majority of all people who has to pay for all this crap by trying to make a living and keep a clean planet. This is just another scam how they take money from the hard working class.

  • Well I for one want a world where my kids can breathe and my grand kids can breathe. You only need to look back 30 years to the skyline of Los Angeles to understand the great strides that emissions control has made. Don’t want DPF / Emissions problems? Service it regularly rather than when a light shows up. Guys there is a difference between reactive and proactive maintenance. I work in an emissions shop and have numerous fleets that follow a standard maintenance schedule and get many trouble free miles. Regardless of the trickery there are obvious give aways that even the least experienced authority will know it was tampered… If it’s “smokin it’s broken”. As VW showed us no amount of programming can circumvent opacity. As for dealers who over charge for diagnostics using carpet bomb logic, I agree it is unnecessarily expensive but like all things, there are other “reputable” sources to have your work done cost effectively.

  • I am hoping a class action law suit will start against Mack truck company. I have a 2008 Mack truck bought new, used as a farm grain hauler with 72000 miles has been broke down so many times cannot count, paid $ 118,000.00 and $ 40,000.00 in repairs and was offered $ 9,000.00 for it running and decent tires.

  • I just spent 2 mounts down. Because of DEF systems. Over 20k in parts and labor. I have a new system. And Now truck is going back in shop because it is a Computer Glitch in the US EPA program. And true emissions are cleaner but Def if a hazardous gas when heted. So what sense does it make to trade one that goes up into the air Vs one that falls to the ground? (Def gas is heavy)

  • Good afterrnoon, my name is Sam and I have been a o/o for 20 yrs. I am on my third freightliner as of 2013. 2013 Freightliner cornado not even 500,000 on it and I am pissed as it is nothing but trouble. So being a 2013 we come equipped with scr and def fluid I assume because of government regulations. I have got to tell you nothing but JUNK! I have been in and out of the shop countless of times spending big money and now I am considering bankruptcy and alot has to do with this system and all that downtime. You spend so much on this system that you neglect the real saftey issues. This is nothing but a money pit. It is almost impossible to make a living, as soon as you get rolling another problem occurs, and let me tell you that you are praying that another problem does not happen, then if it does it will leave you stranded on the side of the road (call a tow truck more money)! I have replaced the entire system included is the one box which I am in the shop for now, and that ain’t cheap. I have replaced def pumps, nozzels, scr filters, metering units etc. I can go on and on, and now my one box. It is an ongoing battle that seems to never end., and then the countless number of hous and time that it takes to diagnose the problem, cost alot of money and dealer rates only seem to be going up and up. Bottom line this is not working for anyone as I know several people in the same boat spending big money, but I guess that is OK for the dealers and the government. It is their emmission systems so they need to pay for it.LOL! I thank you for aking the time to read this as I feel the need to voice my opinion along with many others in the hopes that someone will take it further.

  • Hello all, I’ve had my 2013 Volvo for two years now. I run local 3 days and 2 days I run longer range. Last year I had issues with the scr malfunction codes. ECU issues and so on. I bought a brand new dpf filter installed with all the diagnostics and clamps just over $5000 CAD. The truck ran fine for a few weeks. Then it started again. Took it to Volvo and a dozer valve was the culprit this time. So another $1000+ gone. Drove it for a few more months. Now the same problem is coming back And derates. So far I’m in close to $10,000 on this after treatment repairs Including diagnostics. I’ve had no other issues with the truck mechanically. So yes this system is garbage and draining my pocket.

  • DPF is such a scam.
    Spn codes come up just because it rains and u drive through a puddle. They placed the after treatment control module directly behind the splash guard! And didn’t bother to weather protect it! Any time u get a DPF code the answer is always it could b nothing or u could need a 1 box! Wtf! How is this even legal?

  • hi ,i was reading your article,its right that tampering dpf will cause more airpollution. But think from drivers point of view that installing dpf was not successful ,it gives you a lot of problems, then u find a dealership to get it fixed ,they rip u off plus downtime. its all a game of making money ,im one of the victim ,thats why im crying , iwas paying installments for a new truck , on top of that i have to be at dealership and spending too much on it to get it fixed.only dealers have a software to diagnose the problem,other small micky mouse shops dont have software .But Environment wont try to understand or listen to these problems. Person who make rules cannot be a practical person.

  • Fast forward 2020. Deleting is still the way to go although it’s been made much more difficult. But, it’s really still the way to go as even todays most modern systems still are fraught with problems. DEF is so hilarious. +$6K involved in it’s unit price and you can entirely screw it up with something as simple as two little or too much urea concentration. It will tell you sensors are broken even that the system is missing until you change a tank of DEF and everything was actually fine. When the systems work 100 percent they do their jobs well. But the law and the manufacturers are passing the buck around because they are both petty and one thing law and manufacturers are good at is handing responsibility off to everyone but themselves. Advocates would have you believe that breaking the law makes you a bad person but it doesn’t. It’s just illegal. The next time someone argues with you about it just ask them to tell you how much greenhouse was emitted in just the manufacture of the system itself. I think that much of the emission system development is geared towards getting certain lawyers and politicians well secured but anonymous income.

  • I feel the EPA and other agencies could give a ratbutt what it costs to keep a truck in compliance. It costs me thousands a year in parts and labor to keep my one Class 8 semi-truck in compliance. Emissions are just a money pit that is raising with no end in sight. I have friends that I run with every day that are 100% deleted , produce zero smoke, able to idle in 110 deg temp. running the A/C with worrying about DPF clogging like I have to, Engine oil stays cleaner longer and I’m sure there engine isn’t being packed full of carbon by the EGR system like mine is either. No dealer will repair the deleted trucks and you would have to reverse emissions before selling or trading into a dealer. There are thousands of shops very qualified to do repairs and you can always sell a private party. So the positives outweigh the negatives with the current money pit emission systems today.

  • This DPF hoax is just another form of punishment aimed at truck owners by the lobbyists who want to secure their paychecks. There are no benefits to the environment from this. This system uses more fuel to operate and more fuel to regenerate. Not mentioning cost of frequent repairs and down time.

  • Gpopod morning
    I purchased a 2011 Chev 6.6 / 2500 4×4 Ext. cab a year ago, north of Ottawa.
    The seller said DEF was removed but there is no problem to get safety.
    Unfortunately in London area it is not possible to get safety w/o DEF installed.
    What area’s of Ontario do not require this on a diesel engine.
    Apparently Northern Ont.?

  • It’s tough standing here and reading this. I’m all for helping the environment, but can you honestly say that burning def( urea derived from natural gas, needed for agricultural) in our vehicles is saving the environment? It’s a bandaid used in a hurry to pass emissions, and the egr is helping nobody. I’ve seen filters burning off, pure black smoke, trucks left running just to finish a burn. Who’s the ones doing all these studies? Have they compared a truck running clean, better fuel mileage, less repair, to the other option. What’s the impact on all the extra emissions from the making and packaging of def? The fact is, instead of manufacturing companies being responsible, and building vehicles that burn less fuel and generate more power. Someone decided to get rich, and cash in on the environmentally friendly movement. Don’t be fooled the solution is out there, and it’s not def and egrs. Get your head out your ass, and your hand out of my pocket. I’m tired of this discussion, I have not met a trucker praising these emissions solutions. That’s the truth. I’ve changed pumps, filters, I’ve had def freezing up. Parts and time affect the environment. You what to cut emissions in half? Burn half the fuel. Tax the ones who drive when they have other options, give options to workers needing to get to work( busing services for businesses with more then 20 employees. We get thousands of kids to school, why can’t we do the same for workers?) people are making a lot of money on our concerns, let’s hold their hand in the fire and make change that matters. I just need a real truck!

  • Hi
    My husband and I have been in the trucking business for 37 years. He has always been the mechanic, we own 1 truck 1990 Pete. He is 67 years are house is almost paid off and of course we have no payment on truck or cars for that matter. He has had a heart transplant 10 years ago, he is a hard worker. We are logging at this time, but we have done everything. I am so angry about this whole thing. DMV shut us down, now we are forced to go into debit a lot. Plus the cost of keeping this system up is highway robbery. We were looking forward to retiring in a few years. I can’t see how something that corrodes metals is good for the environment, I’ll bet you they are going to come back and say ooops guess this wasn’t a good idea. We live Fort Bragg Ca. not L.A.. I don’t understand not only is it going to cost for a truck , dmv will choke you, insurance. I mean what hell are we suppose to do? Now we will have to run the truck twice as much to pay for it.

  • The problem is that these def systems are a complete failure in their operation. Manufacturers are not held responsible for the failed system. It is dumped on our laps to continuously repair these systems at an astronomical price being price gouged repeatedly to keep running. The manufacturer and EPA need to pay for all the repairs of these units as well as the repercussions they cause to the engine.

  • The engineers employed by the truck manufactures that come up with these pollution controls, are working for their companies, not for the health of our globe. Oil companies, truck manufacturers and government are all in bed together working for the almighty dollar . When you are burning more than 20% more diesel with these newer trucks than you did years ago with trucks that ran perfect without EGR, DPF and SCR, and DEF, how are we saving the environment? Ever see a regen of a DPF filter on a new semi as it happens on the road ? The truck injects raw fuel into the exhaust so fire can burn out all the sooty particles that have accumulated in the last 10,000 kms , but in a near 30 minutes. Where does that pollution go? It goes right back into the air we breathe. And although DEF and SCR systems look okay for the time being, California residents are complaining now that plants and trees are dying along USA interstates because of the excess ammonia from burnt DEF. I say let the backyard mechanics and tinkerers do their thing and keep working for alternatives to make more horsepower, while saving fuel , and lock up these so called SMART engineers for a while to think about what their pollution control trinkets , that they are so found of adding to these engines, are actually doing to our environment , our children and our grandchildren !

  • If the systems worked they would be respected. If you could fix them economically they would be respected.
    Obviously the man who wrote this piece has not been beaten to a bloody pulp by this devastating technology. Obviously he has not been towed to service shops or called out mobile mechanics over and over and over again to the tune of more than $100 K on one truck alone over five years.
    I have paid dearly for the cost of compliance because that was my first choice.
    I will now pay the cost of noncompliance, or leave the industry.

  • The less fuel you burn the better it is for the environment plus no added chemical to go out the stacks aka ammonia def will cause cancer

  • The USA and Canadian are the only places doing this stuff because they are making big bucks off this stuff!! If these people had to pay for the breakdowns, they would be wanting to get rid of it too. It’s all about the cash for these kinda tree huggers! DEF trucks are junk! No power and use more fuel!! Now California is complaining about Def on their fruits and ground. Just like E-Logs, one more step closer to communist rules and ways.!!! It will take all of us to get rid of both.. We the truckers control the world.. without us nobody gets anything. But the truckers don’t stick together anymore.

  • I’ll tell you what if deleting this bullshit money costing work losing equipment off my truck is wrong and unethical then maybe the manufacturers of this faulty equipment called DPF should fix them free of charge and reimburse me for my lost work and wages when they start owning up to the fact that they make bad equipment then we can talk don’t give me no crap about taking us back to 2002s and a step backwards for the industry